[Table of Contents |Previous Page (Names - Household) |Next Page (Names - Italian)]
St. Kiara was a female Irish saint, c. 680, according to Butler's Lives of the Saints; the name might also be considered an anglicization of the Irish feminine name Ceara (O Corrain & Maguire p.50). (Kiara o Ddinas Emry, July, 1992, pg. 1)
[á Kerry] Since Kerry is the anglicized form of the Irish Ciarraí, we have substituted the English preposition. (Berwyn of Kerry, July, 1992, pg. 3)
Two of July's name submissions sparked a debate on acceptable style for Irish patronymics --- as opposed to grammatically correct style, not quite the same thing --- with Lord Dragon taking one position in the debate and Lord Habicht the other. As far as I can follow the debate, the first position holds that Irish patronymics have a correct grammar which must be used; and, in particular, this means:
The second position holds that, while the above statements are grammatically correct, they were not as strictly followed as grammarians might like; there were, in fact, so many grammatical violations in period that it makes no sense to adhere to the above rules. Combinations of Irish particles with anglicized names (and vice versa), or feminine given names with "male-form" patronymics, were commonly used in period; and we should permit them in Society names as well.
I'm undoubtedly over-simplifying both positions enormously --- and perhaps gotten some details wrong, too --- but I hope I've correctly portrayed the essence of each argument. My forte isn't onomastics, so I must rely on the advice of the onomasticists in the College. Cases that require changing (or even returning) an Irish name will depend on which of these arguments I follow. I don't want to make unnecessary changes to submitted names; but I don't want to condone incorrect practice, either.
This sort of debate is best settled by period evidence. Lord Habicht tells me he's compiled evidence that women did use "male-form" patronymics; Lord Dragon tells me he has documentation for his side as well. Other knowledgeable parties in the College may likewise have evidence to present. I urge everyone, therefore, to publish their findings and viewpoints within the next few months. It would be nice if we could end the year with this matter discussed and settled, once and for all [Policy adopted while waiting follows Lord Dragon's view]. (3 August, 1992 Cover Letter (July, 1992 LoAR), pp. 3-4)
Evidently, the Irish were often found on the Continent during the first millenium A.D., as clerks, missionaries, and scholars. Alcuin brought Irish scribes to the university at Aachen, sponsored by Charlemagne; and St. Gall, the founder of the model monastery in Switzerland, was himself Irish, a disciple of St. Columba. An Irish/German name is thus not beyond the bounds of reason. (Dallan O Fearchaidhe vom Kirschwald, July, 1992, pg. 9)
[Table of Contents |Previous Page (Names - Household) |Top of Page |Next Page (Names - Italian)]
St. Kiara was a female Irish saint, c.680, according to Butler's Lives of the Saints. Kiera has been accepted as a variant spelling (Kiera nic an Bhaird, April 92). (Kiera Lye d'Alessandria, July, 1992, pg. 13)
[ni Connor] The patronymic was submitted as ni Connor, which mixed an Irish particle with an anglicized given name. Lord Dragon found examples of ny as an anglicization of the Irish ní; we have substituted that. (Margaret ny Connor, August, 1992, pg. 16)
The submitter's own documentation gives Rolan as a surname; the closest given name is Rodhlann (or, in modern Irish, Rólann). The double-N changes the sound of the last vowel; it is not a trivial spelling variant [name retured as submittor permitted no changes]. (Rolan O'Cellaigh the Gentle, August, 1992, pg. 25)
The submitter's documentation gives the surname as Ó Ceallaigh, not O'Cellaigh; the construction O'[name], with an apostrophe, is used with anglicized forms [name retured as submittor permitted no changes]. (Rolan O'Cellaigh the Gentle, August, 1992, pg. 25)
According to Lord Palimpsest, [in Irish Gaelic] while the particle Ó prefixes an h to the following vowel, ni does not. (Caitriona Keavy ni Ainle, September, 1992, pg. 4)
[Table of Contents |Previous Page (Names - Household) |Top of Page |Next Page (Names - Italian)]
Tirlach seems a reasonable anglicization of the Irish given name Toirdhealbhach. (Tirlach Kinsella, September, 1992, pg. 17)
Particularly for the old Irish form used here, Mag is a masculine particle, and cannot be used with the feminine name Eórann. (Eórann MagUidir, September, 1992, pg. 45)
Kairenn (Cairenn) appears to be a unique name, that of the mother of Njall of the Nine Hostages of Irish legend. It has been returned before now (Cairenn of CuaRuadh Keep, Aug 91). (Kairenn Suile Gairitecha, September, 1992, pg. 53)
While Brennan may be an anglicization of the Irish Brénainn, as suggested in the LOI, Lord Dolphin notes that it's also a common anglicization of surnames derived from the given name Bránan --- and should therefore be an acceptable spelling of that name as well. (Brennan Conyngham of Ayrshire, October, 1992, pg. 6)
The use of the Russian given name with the Irish patronymic violates our requirements for cultural contact, as outlined in Rule III.2. We need some evidence of period interaction between Russia and Ireland. (Akilina O'Cinndeargain, October, 1992, pg. 22)
Ó Corráin and Maguire (Irish Names ) cite Tara as an anglicization of the period given name Temair, Teamhair. Tara has been submitted by others before, but returned for several reasons: Tara is also the name of the ancient seat of the High Kings of Ireland, and it didn't seem to be a valid rendering of Temair. ("TAH-wair" would be closer to the latter's pronunciation.) The assumption in previous submissions was that Tara is a modern given name, based on the Irish toponymic (or the mansion in Gone with the Wind), and its association with Temair a back-formation; the historical and magical connotations of the Hill of Tara made it unsuitable for a given name.
However, the Irish name for the Hill of Tara (Teamhair) is identical to the documented given name (Columbia Lippincott Gazetter, p.1877; Room's Dictionary of Irish Place Names, p.118). (Ó Corráin and Maguire note that the Hill was, in fact, named after a Temair of Irish myth.) If the given name and the placename are identical in Irish, and Tara is a valid anglicization of the latter, then it should be acceptable as an anglicization of the former. A similar argument, using surnames instead of placenames, was accepted in the registration of Brayden, on the LoAR of July 92; I see no reason not to accept it here. (Tara of Seaborough., November, 1992, pg. 9)
[Table of Contents |Previous Page (Names - Household) |Top of Page |Next Page (Names - Italian)]
The patronymic was submitted as Ó Ceallaigh, with the LOI stating that the submitter "strongly prefers the Gaelic spelling." Her forms, however, also request us to amend the grammar and spelling to be correct for that language. The use of the patronymic particle Ó with a Gaelic name is a purely masculine construction, so far as we can tell from any evidence presented. We've substituted a feminine construction [ní Cheallaigh], with the patronymic aspirated accordingly.
The change described above is our current policy on Irish patronymics; this submission was presented, in part, as an appeal of that policy. The appeal was supposed to have been based on period usage, but little evidence was presented in support: The LOI refers the reader to the client's previous submission (West LOI of 4 April 92). That LOI, in turn, refers to an LOC by Lord Habicht, 10 Nov 88. That LOC, in its turn, refers to a biography of Grania O'Malley (Anne Chambers' Granuaile) which "gives a listing of the many ways that Grania Ui Mhaille's name was rendered in both Gaelic and English records" --- without citing names or dates. At this point, the appeal has gone beyond the bounds of "evidence" into the realm of "folklore".
In asking commenters to present documentation on Gaelic patronymics (LoAR cover letter of 3 Aug 92), I'd hoped to reach a final synthesis based on research. Results of that research to date have supported our current policy: that, for purely Gaelic patronymics, masculine constructions should not be used in female names. (A handful of examples were offered of female names in masculine constructions --- but they all seem to be anglicized forms, not pure Gaelic forms.) I'd be delighted if counter-evidence were presented --- I all but got down on my knees and begged for such counter-evidence to be presented --- but none has been received to date. As our current policy is based on evidence, so must any change in policy be based on evidence.
The submitter may be ní Cheallaigh (purely Irish) or O'Kelly (anglicized Irish), but without real documentation to support the construction, she may not be ...Ó Ceallaigh. (Katherine ní Cheallaigh of Skye, January, 1993, pg. 19)
Fionnula, in Irish legend, was one of the children of Lir who was transformed into a swan. However, as the name was much used by humans in late period, the combination of Fionnula with a swan is not an excessive reference to the legend; see the LoAR of Aug 92, p.17. (Deirdre ni Fhionnula, May, 1993, pg. 4) Logan seems acceptable as an anglicization of the Irish Locân, Leogán (Logan Hawkwood, May, 1993, pg. 12)
Yiddish, from Eastern Europe, has not been shown to have enough period interaction with Irish to justify combining them in a name. (Deborah Fey O'Mora, August, 1993, pg. 9)
While we have evidence of Arabic/Italian interaction in period, Persian/Italian interaction has yet to be demonstrated. (Beatrice Carmela Mercante, September, 1993, pg. 6)
There was some question of Gaelic-Italian interaction in period, but note that St. Columbanus of Ireland (b. Leinster, 543 AD) founded his last monastery in Bobbio, in the foothills of the Apennine mountains of Italy, bringing Christianity to the heathens living there. (Gabriella Allegra Palumbo O'Loingsigh, October, 1993, pg. 19)
[Table of Contents |Previous Page (Names - Household) |Top of Page |Next Page (Names - Italian)]